Looking at Computers - Advice Appreciated!

[Eriottosan]

Hey all. My laptop is pretty much dead now, and I always promised myself that once this one goes, I was going to get myself a proper desktop to replace it. That time has come a tad earlier than expected, and funds are tight, but I may or may not be getting some money to help fund a new computer. At any rate, I was looking at building one rather than buying premade, largely because I'm a control freak ;). It's my first venture in this kind of thing, but I have friends who can help me, so it's not an issue.

The computer will be used for every day use as well as gaming.

As it stands, my current plan is to go with a barebones bundle from a localish store (it's pretty much the same price as if I were to get the parts myself)

"The main specifications of this barebones are: -

AMD FX-6 Six Core 6300 Processor
2 x 4GB DDR3 1333Mhz Memory
Novatech Gaming Tower Case
750W Gaming PSU
AMD 970 Chipset"

As for the rest, I'm looking at 1TB hard drive and the AMD Radeon HD 7850 graphics card.

It's not that I don't trust my friends' judgements, but I'd much rather have an honest opinion from people who won't just agree with me for the sake of being friends since school - so where better place to ask than my favourite forum?

There is an almost identical barebones package where the only difference is it has an AMD Bulldozer FX-8 Eight Core 8320 Processor instead, but I don't think I need to spend an extra £30 on that processor upgrade.
Equally, I could go for the 7870, but again, it's more money for something that isn't a massive leap ahead.

So, thoughts?
Thanks

[mazer246]

Gotta say, thats a pretty expensive kit, by my standards at least. If you give me an estimated budget range, I could get you a bunch of links on newegg.com. Also remember, more cores is not necessarily better. You only need 6-8 core processers if you are really into video editing/rendering/that kinda stuff. Most games and programs only use one core, and its much better to have 4 fast cores rather than 6-8 slower ones. If you want, I can really look into this for you.

[Syruse]

A word on the FX series of processors, they are fast but that speed comes at a price, they run pretty hot. If you're going to run it hard (and it sounds like you will if your going for a 7850) you're probably going to need a liquid cooling unit, a reliable one will run you upwards $100.

I have a Phenom II x6 1045T and a Radeon HD 7770 and can run pretty much everything in high/ultra (The few exceptions I've found were Far Cry 3 and Batman Arkham City, for the most part they ran well, but in some areas frame rate would chug). Just a penny for your thoughts.

[odranoel]

well im no computer expert, but my advise would be to, concentrate on getting the best mother board & CPU your funds will let you at the moment. becuase everything else (ramm, video card, ECT) can always be upgraded later once youv aquired more funds. so instead of trying to get an over all system with in your current funds, try and get the best basic components that normally are a bitch to upgrade later (again mainly CPU and mother board)

that way maybe your comp wont be exactly as you want it at first, but you know you can always upgrade it to the specs you want later. cuz iv made that mistake befor. i wanted a complete system with lotsa ramm and everything, so to stay with in my budget i kinda skimped on the CPU a lil bit so everything would be within my price range. now i greatly regret that decition cuz i should have consentrated on the most important thing (CPU & mother board) and then upgraded all the rest of the stuff once i had the apropriate funds. cuz now iv done all the perifireal upgrades, but im still stuck with a semi decent CPU. and to upgrade the CPU, i might as well get a new computer.

so ya, learn from my mistakes, get the best CPU you can. then all the rest of the stuff you can go upgradeing little by little as you get the funds for it :)

[Eriottosan]

Also remember, more cores is not necessarily better. You only need 6-8 core processers if you are really into video editing/rendering/that kinda stuff. Most games and programs only use one core, and its much better to have 4 fast cores rather than 6-8 slower ones.

See, that's what I thought, but when I said this to my friends who are helping me, they sort of ... tutted :P. The thing I said about agreeing with old friends goes both ways, I guess. Which is part of the reason I decided to ask people less connected. I dabble in editing and stuff now and then (or did back home on a friend's beast of a computer), but it's not something I want to base processor choice on the back of.

If you want, I can really look into this for you.

A little advice would be lovely, but you don't need to "really look into it" for me, especially as I'm UK based, and the site you use states its regions as US/Canada/China.

For the record, budget wise, it's technically as cheap as possible, while still being able to get serious use on it without getting left behind. Which I suppose is everyone's ideal ;).
I'd rather not go above the £400 mark (~$650?), excluding monitor/mouse/keyboard/OS as they are accounted for. But the current system is more in line with £500, because these friends have talked me up that far, being the power/tech/takeitandrunwithit types they are. They seem to know a lot,t and I've seen a few builds they've built, but they, like me, are young, so I'd rather not just take their word as gospel.
Money isn't something I have much of, by any range, but I might be getting some money in specifically for the computer (If not, it will be a few months of saving and going without).

A word on the FX series of processors, they are fast but that speed comes at a price, they run pretty hot.

Thanks for that, I think I'd better pass it on, as they seem a little obsessed with the barebones package. As I said, they seem to just be going crazy with the project, which is why I'm looking for advice, so I can take control of it a bit more. (Why is it so hard to say no to friends, even if they're doing something for you?!)

I have a Phenom II x6 1045T and a Radeon HD 7770 and can run pretty much everything in high/ultra

I'll look into it, thanks for the tip (:.

my advise would be to, concentrate on getting the best mother board & CPU your funds will let you at the moment. becuase everything else (ramm, video card, ECT) can always be upgraded later once youv aquired more funds. so instead of trying to get an over all system with in your current funds, try and get the best basic components that normally are a bitch to upgrade later

Sound advice, thanks man, I'll bear it in mind (:.

[Syruse]

Oh, what motherboard are you getting? If you're looking for expandability (you always should) I'd try to find one with support for socket AM3+ (pretty much standard these days), >8GB of RAM (more than 2 DIM modules), and crossfire compatibility.

[Eriottosan]

Oh, what motherboard are you getting?

Good question. For some reason, the specification for the BareBones package don't state the make/model. I've fired off an email asking, but in the mean time, it does specify the details of it (spoilered). AM3+ support and 4 memory slots, the only thing I'm not sure of is the crossfire compatibility - the fact that one of the PCIs is listed as x4 mode, and the other is x16 suggests to me that it probably is compatible, but there'll be a performance hit - surely two x8 would be better ... Seems another reason to go completely from scratch rather than start with a bundle, to me.

Spoiler

Show

Motherboard
Description AMD 970 Chipset
Chipset AMD 970 Chipset
Memory Slots 4
Audio Realtek ALC887 8-Channel High Definition Audio CODEC
PCI 2
PCI-EX 1 x PCIe 2.0 x16 (blue)
1 x PCIe 2.0 x16 (x4 mode, black)
2 x PCIe 2.0 x1
RAID Support Raid 0, 1, 5, 10
SATA Ports 6
Socket Type AM3+
USB 2 x USB 3.0/2.0 port(s) (2 at back panel, blue)
12 x USB 2.0/1.1 port(s) (6 at back panel, black, 6 at mid-board)
CPU Support AMD AM3+ FX/Phenom II/Athlon II/Sempron 100 Series Processors
Form Factor ATX Form Factor
IO 1 x PS/2 keyboard (purple)
1 x PS/2 mouse (green)
1 x LAN (RJ45) port(s)
2 x USB 3.0
6 x USB 2.0
3 x Audio jack(s)
LAN Realtek 8111F, 1 x Gigabit LAN Controller
Max FSB DDR3 2133(O.C.)/1866/1600/1333/1066 MHz ECC
Max Memory Capacity 32GB

[Syruse]

Yeah, hopefully they'll respond with the model number at least. Motherboards that are Crossfire/SLI ready are usually listed as so, if the kit doesn't say then it probably isn't. If I recall correctly, for Crossfire, both PCIe x16 need to be at x16 (x4 mode is for like sound cards, I can't really think of anything else that uses it)

[Eriottosan]

To be honest, from everything that's been said, I think I'd be better off doing what I planned to originally and build from scratch, rather than starting with a barebones kit. The only reason I folded in the first place is because my friends got all excited by the barebones deal.

[Ulfengaard]

To be honest, from everything that's been said, I think I'd be better off doing what I planned to originally and build from scratch, rather than starting with a barebones kit. The only reason I folded in the first place is because my friends got all excited by the barebones deal.

That would be best. I did this, and I've never regretted it. I'll never buy an assembled (even bare bones) desktop again. Just do your research, and you'll get an incredible deal compared to a pre-built system.

[Syruse]

Just remember to always do your research before committing to anything, benchmark tests and customer reviews are your best friends. I use Passmark for any benchmark tests and amazon, newegg, tigerdirect, as well as manufacture sites for customer reviews.

[Eriottosan]

That would be best. I did this, and I've never regretted it. I'll never buy an assembled (even bare bones) desktop again. Just do your research, and you'll get an incredible deal compared to a pre-built system.

Just remember to always do your research before committing to anything, benchmark tests and customer reviews are your best friends. I use Passmark for any benchmark tests and amazon, newegg, tigerdirect, as well as manufacture sites for customer reviews.

Really think that's what I'll do. I really think I'm competent enough to go about it all myself, and I only really asked them to as a sort of failsafe, and for friendship's sake. But I feel like they're just forcing their own preferences on me, when I have enough of an understanding to be able to do the research myself.

[weldaSB]

I know you said you had an os, but if you think you ever might want to use Linux, you should think about getting an nvidia gpu because they have better Linux drivers. About sli/crossfire, you really don't need more than 1gpu unless you are doing intense video editing or heavy graphical mathematical functions. For gaming, 1 gpu is more than enough.

[SterlingRed]

I would recommend if possible getting an ssd instead of a HDD for your os install. I upgraded to one and noticed a significant performance increase, and my desktop wasn't shabby to begin with. Ssd's pack a lot of bang for the buck if used as the main drive.
Large ssd drives are expensive, so I'd recommend getting a small one like 128gb or 256gb and using a second normal HHD to store anything you aren't using on a daily basis. Unless you are doing video editing/recording most people don't need 1tb as their main drive.

[Benanov]

I know you said you had an os, but if you think you ever might want to use Linux, you should think about getting an nvidia gpu because they have better Linux drivers. About sli/crossfire, you really don't need more than 1gpu unless you are doing intense video editing or heavy graphical mathematical functions. For gaming, 1 gpu is more than enough.

"Better" depends - right now the Nvidia drivers work well, but they break other parts of the system (like virtual terminals, Ctrl-Alt-F1 etc) and multi-monitor kinda sucks iirc. Also, if you bork the binary driver install (like, the latest Ubuntu really screwed the pooch here), you effectively have no video, because Nvidia's X server is not the X server shipped with the system. Nothing like using VESA to get your graphics up and running! (What is this, Windows?)

I have become accustomed to having shit work when I put the CD in. Nvidia binary drivers do not glom with that sentiment.

Nouveau (the Free drivers for nv cards) is making leaps & bounds, but is way behind. Nvidia Optimus (two video cards switching to save power) is poorly supported. Stay away for now.

ATi...they work out of the box, with the Free "radeon" driver working better than nouveau, but there's some stagnation these days iirc and there's still some performance problems with the Free drivers compared to the non-free ones.